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  1. #21

    Re: feedback on Abin Surs Lantern Changes (Post june Patch)

    So, my thoughts after actually playing with it tonight. It's not quite as bad as I thought... but it's still pretty darned bad. Controllers are nerfed so as a class, they all just got a ton weaker, between the Gambit nerf (again, PLEASE re-add stacking of Investment 1 at level 2, as in the unmodded version) and the Abin Sur's/Deadshot's nerf. I see you made Harley's default modset a Marksman modset... you may as well just re-label her like you did Robin. She's actually buffed as a marksman, but her core build has been destroyed as a controller, after nerfs 4 patches in a row.

    ArcGL I haven't tried yet, but considering the numbers, and the difficulty of keeping him alive to keep those stacks, he's probably unplayably bad. He was already in a bad place due to previous nerfs, like Harley as a Controller, due to the same item nerfs, and in addition a huge nerf to his ulti.

    Night Supes actually kind of needed the nerf, honestly. He was getting a little OP. However, the thing that is the biggest problem for Controllers is that Controllers as a whole got nerfed, while every Enforcer but Ivy got a buff. What do I mean by that? Ruby of Life being viable on Health-stacking supports. It has made, for example, Mecha Supes probably top-tier. In the new meta, I actually suspect him to be the strongest support, even eclipsing API. It probably helps Robin a lot as well, and with the Lobo's Chain new mod (which is awesome, BTW) it actually puts him in a better place. All in all, this update will REALLY shake the meta, and make playing Support pretty much mean playing Enforcers at the high-end of the game... which at least keeps the game playable, but I really liked the large number of viable champs in the Support role... and a few of them just got nerfed into being unviable.

  2. #22
    Joining Harmony TeaSeeOh's Avatar
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    Re: feedback on Abin Surs Lantern Changes (Post june Patch)

    Quote Originally Posted by akerasi View Post
    So, my thoughts after actually playing with it tonight. It's not quite as bad as I thought... but it's still pretty darned bad. Controllers are nerfed so as a class, they all just got a ton weaker, between the Gambit nerf (again, PLEASE re-add stacking of Investment 1 at level 2, as in the unmodded version) and the Abin Sur's/Deadshot's nerf. I see you made Harley's default modset a Marksman modset... you may as well just re-label her like you did Robin. She's actually buffed as a marksman, but her core build has been destroyed as a controller, after nerfs 4 patches in a row.

    ArcGL I haven't tried yet, but considering the numbers, and the difficulty of keeping him alive to keep those stacks, he's probably unplayably bad. He was already in a bad place due to previous nerfs, like Harley as a Controller, due to the same item nerfs, and in addition a huge nerf to his ulti.

    Night Supes actually kind of needed the nerf, honestly. He was getting a little OP. However, the thing that is the biggest problem for Controllers is that Controllers as a whole got nerfed, while every Enforcer but Ivy got a buff. What do I mean by that? Ruby of Life being viable on Health-stacking supports. It has made, for example, Mecha Supes probably top-tier. In the new meta, I actually suspect him to be the strongest support, even eclipsing API. It probably helps Robin a lot as well, and with the Lobo's Chain new mod (which is awesome, BTW) it actually puts him in a better place. All in all, this update will REALLY shake the meta, and make playing Support pretty much mean playing Enforcers at the high-end of the game... which at least keeps the game playable, but I really liked the large number of viable champs in the Support role... and a few of them just got nerfed into being unviable.
    I was thinking the same, honestly. A lot of these item changes really hurt more than help, I feel.

    Even items that were borderline controller/bruiser/adc, such as Deadshot just fall flat now. The lack of stacking Will passive completely destroys the Intensity active as well. You burn through Will so fast with the active, and it doesn't even add that much damage anymore due to the lack of total Will you can feasibly get on a lesser number of slots in comparison to before.

    Not digging a majority of the changes that came with this patch item wise.

  3. #23
    Considering Harmony SoundByte's Avatar
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    Re: feedback on Abin Surs Lantern Changes (Post june Patch)

    I guess I understand what you were trying to do with abin surs since deadshots was so similar but honestly I probably would've preferred you leave the Force of Will and Will Force keywords as a mod for abin surs so that way you could choose whether you wanted attack or power damage that way. I think with this new coin stacking system on it, it makes it so hard for controllers to make any sort of comebacks because if you're behind, then you are almost guaranteed to stay behind because your (will based) shields are too unreliable in terms of how much strength they give now. My other issue is that the Shining Will Aura is a flat 8 will regen for every tier of abin surs. I really wish that aura gave a flat 8 plus having the extra will regen you get from stacks added to the aura. (i.e. having 20 will regen aura at max stacks)

  4. #24
    Community Advocate CH4_BrianFantana's Avatar
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    Re: feedback on Abin Surs Lantern Changes (Post june Patch)

    https://www.infinitecrisis.com/forum...l=1#post110951

    My overall opinion and suggestions for controllers overall.
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  5. #25
    Joining Harmony TeaSeeOh's Avatar
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    Re: feedback on Abin Surs Lantern Changes (Post june Patch)

    Quote Originally Posted by iM-SoundByte View Post
    I guess I understand what you were trying to do with abin surs since deadshots was so similar but honestly I probably would've preferred you leave the Force of Will and Will Force keywords as a mod for abin surs so that way you could choose whether you wanted attack or power damage that way. I think with this new coin stacking system on it, it makes it so hard for controllers to make any sort of comebacks because if you're behind, then you are almost guaranteed to stay behind because your (will based) shields are too unreliable in terms of how much strength they give now. My other issue is that the Shining Will Aura is a flat 8 will regen for every tier of abin surs. I really wish that aura gave a flat 8 plus having the extra will regen you get from stacks added to the aura. (i.e. having 20 will regen aura at max stacks)
    This a million times.

    I was going to suggest the exact same be done. The coin stack doesn't make sense on something as weak off as only Will. They would be better off just giving Abin Sur's the old Will Battery, to where each skill use stacks toward the total amount of will, then you can choose to get the new Eye of Ekron or Deadshot's Visor.

  6. #26
    Protector AIpha's Avatar
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    Re: feedback on Abin Surs Lantern Changes (Post june Patch)

    Stacking is a no no on support centered items. It means you have to focus more on getting coins and staying alive than protecting your teammates which is counter intative to what a support should be doing. Instead if you must change them they should have acted like Jokers Crowbar/Crime Bible/TwoFaces Coin. Gaining X will for each kill or assist and every 90s. That way you get will for assisting your teammates and over time. It works out to be a very good item for supports who generally grab will items anyway.

  7. #27
    Protector Unilord's Avatar
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    Re: feedback on Abin Surs Lantern Changes (Post june Patch)

    Have to agree in this one, the change of abin sur to a collector item was not very bright idea, specially to the change to the stacking. If it were 30 stack max like before it would still be bad, but bearable with the mod (you would only lose 8 stacks per death= 4coins), but having both is overkill.

    On the other hand I like the idea of having some controller specific items regardless of AD/PD, so you don't need to use 2 custom page as before, one for deadshot champs and other for abin sur's.

  8. #28

    Re: feedback on Abin Surs Lantern Changes (Post june Patch)

    Quote Originally Posted by Wurm_king View Post
    you see my biggest concern is late game. let say on Divided you have just died after breaching into the enemies base. now how do you replace that lost will because you cant get it from drones. and if your allies need coins for there items there are only so many in the jungle and controllers cant compete with assassins and bruisers in harvesting coins from the jungle.
    im gonna field this one

    everyone in range of the coin collected gets a stack for their collectors, so if your entire team is sat in mid lane pushing, and kills a wave of 6 drones, every single person in the team gets 6 coin stacks (12 with accelerated)
    exact same thing if you all go to the jungle together, you will all get a stack for each jungle creep killed.
    This means as support you dont need to focus on collecting coins, just do what youve been doing, keep your carry alive, and im sure he will be killing creeps for you

  9. #29

    Re: feedback on Abin Surs Lantern Changes (Post june Patch)

    Tbh its even worse now.

    Will harvest is good But at 90 seconds per 10 will means u need a 60 minute game (assuming paired with a bad lane partner/good opponents) without mods you need 20 kills/assists to max it (10 if you mod for it)

    They new change hurts more than the old collector.

  10. #30
    Protector Unilord's Avatar
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    Re: feedback on Abin Surs Lantern Changes (Post june Patch)

    Quote Originally Posted by Dannin View Post
    Tbh its even worse now.

    Will harvest is good But at 90 seconds per 10 will means u need a 60 minute game (assuming paired with a bad lane partner/good opponents) without mods you need 20 kills/assists to max it (10 if you mod for it)

    They new change hurts more than the old collector.
    So mod it, now you only need 30 min.

 

 

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