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  1. #41
    Protector Bearsss's Avatar
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    Re: Map Balance - August patch

    *shrugs* tried to help. Best of luck but also faster Ganges also mean shorter que time.... In theory.

  2. #42
    Level Designer Fantus's Avatar
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    Re: Map Balance - August patch

    Quote Originally Posted by Bearsss View Post

    Reason why I rarely play GD is because of timing. It just takes TOOO long and I just dont have the time to give.
    Yep, we agree. We want to make match times shorter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bearsss View Post
    Personally the respawn time will come back and haunt the game if its increased. One for new players it will be a major punishment for them and also like some one else mentioned before. It would promote safer game play. You'll see even less deaths because people will do allot less engaging meaning the game will only be LONGER (experinced players). Plus I would not like to forever wait after I die to respawn and move across the map like a snail after I respawn.
    Post 30 minutes, the respawn timers are really close to the same values as before this change. It really won't have an effect on the early and mid game play, only late game play. Feasibly, games should be ending around the 35-40 minute mark, so you will have 1-2 deaths with the increased timer in a single game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bearsss View Post
    Now lets look at the reason why CC/GH dont take as long.

    Beside different objectives.

    The maps are smaller so conflicts happen a lot more. Building coin is faster. Lets take these examples and bring them to GD since it worked on these maps.
    GD is a bigger map, and there isn't a whole lot to do about it without a complete redesign. The credit velocity is increased on those maps because we wanted them to be really short, with their swingy objectives. GD is supposed to be a battle of inches, and the more free credits we give out, reduces the overall gap in currency leading to no one ever feeling like they are a superstar.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bearsss View Post
    Increasing the speed of champs means champs will be more engaging. More ganks and jungle action. Map movement will be faster.
    This isn't really true. Increasing the movement speed of champions will make skill shots harder to hit, evasiveness will go up, and players will be able to get away more often. We don't think this really translates to more ganks and jungle action.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bearsss View Post
    Adding another bot to each wave also means more coin also meaning faster building also meaning mid and late game building will come fast causing towers to get rushed earlier.
    If we did add more drones to the wave, we wouldn't be adding more currency on to them, we would just spread the existing coin across more drones. With our higher credit velocity model we had the issue of people maxing out all 6 slots 20-30 minutes before the game ended. It's not fun to be rich if you have nothing to spend your money on.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bearsss View Post
    Why not decrease the bot respawn timer. At least as the game goes on. More waves coming at the enemy faster means you can have bots push or the champ push. Its a new plan making move for games and would speed up coin building on top of that.
    All this would serve to do is make the map unstable. The more AI's we add to the map, means the more CPU intensive the match will be as we have to draw more and more drones on the screen, and the more the servers would struggle to keep track of all of them. This is not really and option from a tech standpoint, and we don't think it would really help from a gameplay standpoint either. [Fact: we already have upwards of 220 AI's on the map already!]

    Quote Originally Posted by Bearsss View Post
    Thanks for reading.
    Thanks for your feedback!

  3. #43
    Protector Bearsss's Avatar
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    Re: Map Balance - August patch

    Okay. I understand.

    So once it hits 30 mins there will be at least a 2 minute respawn time giving a hell Alot OF Time To Punch through those turrets. On paper it seems like it would work.

    As for the the server Handling hundreds of AI. Just sneek in NASA and "Borrow" there super server. That would fix that issue. LoL. Really though I never thought about the stress the AI would cause nor on the people computers seeing how IC can run on Win 8 tabletswith or major issue. Adding more drones would change that.
    Last edited by Bearsss; 08-01-2014 at 07:21 PM. Reason: spelling

  4. #44
    Joining Harmony Chrysalis's Avatar
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    Re: Map Balance - August patch

    Quote Originally Posted by IC_Fantus View Post
    (snip)

    Sure, we agree, being dead isn't fun. Being in a 50 minute game that was over at 35 minutes isn't fun either. The point of this change is to finish matches that are over already.
    Presumably matches that are "already over" are a done-deal because statistically and numerically the other team cannot make up the point difference in drones, firepower etc.

    We have a /ff surrender option for the maps but why not add a statistical % message/window/notice about the probability of winning? This would encourage teams that are facing 90%-10% to just /ff at that point. This would knock off a good chunk of time for those wanting to opt for a surrender and could be ignored by teams that want to go the distance.

    It's not enough to see numbers like in GH because it's not always clear that 390-280 is a winner/loser game. A box showing the your probablility of winning in % would help: 90% win for the 390 team's box score and 10% win in the 290 team's boxes.

    ex:

    I played CC the other night. I'm not good at any of the champions I play. I can barely play GH but jumped in for "the experience". As I "know nothing John Snow" about the map the poor guys who got landed with me, figured out early the game was a bust and put up the surrender option. However, being a noob and only a few minutes into the game I didn't know we'd already lost so I didn't vote for it. We played another 10+ min before the home base blew up.

    If I had a window showing the game balance % I could have seen that we were @75-25; getting worse by the minute and that the come back wasn't going to happen. It would have been better to release and re-queue than to drag it out.

    re: re-spawn timer and map play time

    After playing CC I remembered why I don't like those maps. Aside from not really being qualified to play on them (see above). It takes a very long time to play (see Bearsss comment). Sitting at home base in a re-spawn state is my normal champion state on any map which is: D E A D. Having to spend 15 min of every 30 min in this state is definitely NOT fun and NOT encouraging.

    If anything reduce the respawn timer so you can get back in the match and push the other team. If you died, the other team already got their kill buff from you, so why do you want to penalize players even more? Seems counter productive to me.
    "C'est magnifique, mais ce n'est pas la guerre. C'est de la folie."
    ("It is magnificent, but it is not war. It is madness.")

    ~ French Marshal Pierre Bosquet ~

  5. #45
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    Re: Map Balance - August patch

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick3570 View Post
    80+ seconds at 35 minutes seems like a bit long to me. It's a lot of time just doing nothing if you die. I feel like just increasing the movespeed, either base or scaling, on all champs so it doesn't take 30 seconds to get halfway across the map would be a better way to speed the game up.

    80+ seconds is too long, and its something i dont understand. You want this game to be about team fights? and you break up a team for 80 seconds? that late in the game you start running into instant deletions. So you mix it up with a team, and lose someone what do you do for the next 70+ seconds your down someone? this also can cause staggering.. meaning if you lose a champ or 2 with in that first 80 second window.. the will rejoin the group a different times, which could mean that you are constantly at a disadvantage.

    also couldn't this stall the game out longer as well? I mean the reason the core take a while is because the defending team is fighting back, surrounded by turrets, if the winning team is suddenly down a few champs, they have to wait 2 minutes for reinforcements

    I dont know exactly how to get shorter matches but death timers always suck, What if instead of longer death timers, the champs did increasing amounts of damage to structures? what if their siege damage started to surpass their normal damage outputs? So you more quickly wiped out turrets, and the core?

    This means that the team that's behind still has a chance to make a comeback, maybe with few defenders, at the core, the underdog could come up and blow through the remaining turret and core before the enemy is able to wipe yours out.

    You could also have this increased damage depend on time X number of Turrets/ number of remaining enemy turrets. So if the games over as you say, but the dead team. The damage to structures would be so high their would be no stopping the core for getting blown up with just a few hits. But if its a close both sides will have the same amount of Siege damage and it will come down to who can defend better.

    You should try anything else before you add longer waiting to play time, more feeling helpless time, more man i screwed up time.

    more siege damage would make you more effective at using the death then making the other player wait to help.
    Last edited by Mideran; 08-04-2014 at 05:53 PM.

  6. #46
    Protector AI-Voltzoen's Avatar
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    Re: Map Balance - August patch

    I would suggest the core generating a minion(Predator like) when all the dampeners are down to help defend the area. It can only happen once per match but if half your team is dead and you are trying to defend then it would go a long way to help that champion. Maybe it can only happen if certain conditions are met? Of course this is just for GD and 5v5 CC.

 

 

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