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Thread: Why Atomic Axe?

  1. #1

    Why Atomic Axe?

    Why do so many people start with Atomic Axe? With the general lack of armor at those levels, Coda Blade is the far superior choice. For 1750 you get 40 AD (49 w/Mod), 10 pen, and wounding if you have that mod. With Atomic Axe you have 30 AD (39 w/Mod), Razor (which is a percentage) for 2250 that won't give you the same return on investment until 8-10.

    My question is why start with it? Atomic Axe is a counter building tool, like Book of Eternity, that's strength comes later in the game rather than minutes 1-5. Personally I have seen it in one too many games and guides for GH to be comfortable with what I believe is an ineffective practice.
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  2. #2
    Providing Harmony KoH_David's Avatar
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    Re: Why Atomic Axe?

    There is no reason to start with it. It's a waste of gold to get it in the early game. No different then going nil and some items at the start of the game.

  3. #3
    Considering Harmony Firellius's Avatar
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    Re: Why Atomic Axe?

    Because Heights is bruiser only, and bruisers have stupid high natural defenses for no reason. Atomic Axe helps more than Coda, I'd wager, and retains its value through the first five minutes. After those five minutes, Coda is massively inferior.

  4. #4

    Re: Why Atomic Axe?

    Quote Originally Posted by Firellius View Post
    Because Heights is bruiser only, and bruisers have stupid high natural defenses for no reason. Atomic Axe helps more than Coda, I'd wager, and retains its value through the first five minutes. After those five minutes, Coda is massively inferior.
    With the +9 mod you have a lot more damage especially with W+Ult on GA. Even with bruiser's natural Attack Armor, the damage plus armor pen combo just starts to catch up 10-12 as long as they are counter building attack armor. And with GH you want to dominate from the start. Starting out bad can be horrible.
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    Considering Harmony Firellius's Avatar
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    Re: Why Atomic Axe?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Dycer View Post
    With the +9 mod you have a lot more damage especially with W+Ult on GA. Even with bruiser's natural Attack Armor, the damage plus armor pen combo just starts to catch up 10-12 as long as they are counter building attack armor. And with GH you want to dominate from the start. Starting out bad can be horrible.
    Well, I just got out of a game where three enemies built Suit of Sorrows as their second/third item. If I had started with the Atomic Axe, my damage would've been fine.

    Suit of Sorrows, bruisers. You NEED the Atomic Axe, Coda isn't going to cut it.

  6. #6
    Protector Xoulrath's Avatar
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    Re: Why Atomic Axe?

    The Axe is a counter-building item, plain and simple. If you start with it, then you are hurting yourself and your team. Coda has more damage, the flat pen is fine in most instances, and the healing debuff is right there at level 4 should you need it (and with all of the new healing, you do).

    Only buy Axe AFTER your chosen targets have started to stack Armor.
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  7. #7
    Considering Harmony Firellius's Avatar
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    Re: Why Atomic Axe?

    Quote Originally Posted by Xoulrath View Post
    The Axe is a counter-building item, plain and simple. If you start with it, then you are hurting yourself and your team. Coda has more damage, the flat pen is fine in most instances, and the healing debuff is right there at level 4 should you need it (and with all of the new healing, you do).

    Only buy Axe AFTER your chosen targets have started to stack Armor.
    Yeah, except it's Gotham Heights. EVERYONE builds Suit of Sorrows, first or second item. Just 750 gold and Coda Blade is useless compared to Atomic Axe.

    If you try to buy Atomic Axe after they start to stack armor, you're already too late.

  8. #8

    Re: Why Atomic Axe?

    Well you understand little about item tiers. You need Suit of Sorrows to be at T3 for Atomic Axe T2 to have a major advantage over Coda Blade T3. At 100 you negate ~25% of intended damage if I remember correctly. At T2 Atomic Axe you have 30% pen making it so you are going against 70 AD armor which I think reduces 15% compared to 85 Armor which I believe reduces around 20% of damage when using Coda Blade. To make calculations easy let's make Coda Blade + base damage equal 100 and Atomic Axe's equal 90. 90x.85(% of damage unaffected)= 76.5 and 100x.80= 80. I know the numbers in here may not be 100% accurate, but it takes until 140-150 AD armor, and/or 180 damage (with enemy's counter-building) for Atomic Axe to exceed in just damage. Now cost effectiveness is a separate spiel...
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  9. #9
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    Re: Why Atomic Axe?

    100 Attack Armour grants 50% Attack Damage Reduction. The formula is (Attack Armour/Attack Armour + 100).

    Atomic Axe 2 is very much about penetration, it matches Coda 3's penetration at 33 Attack Armour, which is entirely possible for people to start with. I would discourage upgrading Atomic Axe 1 this early though, you only get 10 AD and it's not quite worth the 1k at this early stage. Atomic Axe 1's 10% Attack Penetration IS admittedly weak, but the Attack Boost is significant and if you take the +AD mod it's an easy way to start with a lot of AD (Coda 2 + Mace 1 beats it with 32 AD to modded axe 1's 29, but doesn't have the penetration.) Atomic Axe 1 isn't far behind Coda 3 (the most cost effective Coda) in Attack Damage - 20 to 40 (both with +9 mods) when the 500 credit difference is worth 14 ad (Mace 2), and it's harder to negate by building attack armour.

    That said, I definitely wouldn't start Atomic Axe it's just too squishy and not damaging enough at the very start. I don't like Coda either, I don't feel it scales well into midgame at all.
    Last edited by Volandum; 08-30-2014 at 05:10 AM.

  10. #10
    Considering Harmony KoH_Epoch's Avatar
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    Re: Why Atomic Axe?

    I've noticed a lot of axe starts too, and I can tell you that it definitely does not counter an opening with armor items (SoS included). The attack pen becomes significant when you get the tier 2 axe in addition to an already AD-stacked build, but it's a weak starting item.

    Starting suit of sorrows, on the other hand, can definitely work. 35 armor for 750 is an exceptionally good deal. I had a game last night where the enemy team was AD-heavy and I opened with SoS and Mace 1 on Catwoman rather than coda and mace, and it allowed me to stay alive. Never underestimate the power of staying alive to cap things. Often, being alive > getting mad kills, particularly if your team maintains an ongoing power play (# of players alive advantage).

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    The opposing Bat prime opened with axe 1 and it didn't work out for him. They lost the top fights because of lack of sustain (and because their Wonder Woman was wasting tons of money on power armor she didn't need). I didn't start dying until late game when I encountered Harley. Their Harley was absolutely destroying our MWW bottom lane and evading early gank attempts really well. MWW was 1/10 at one point and didn't get her kills until very late game. Harley is the reason I have a booster gold power suit--an item I would normally never build on catwoman (I probably should have had Metallo's in retrospect).

 

 

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